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Post by melodypottersnape on Sept 23, 2012 4:24:18 GMT -5
In LC fic I wanted to slap Hermione when she had her call Harry spoiled. She truly got me into her story to were I was actually talking ahile reading. One of my remarks was after the spoiling comment. I said something like 'Yeah, she's okay with them getting in trouble for things, but last time I checked she doesn't have her parents there.' My mom overheard me and shot me an odd look.lol
My opinion of her.
1st year
I loved the intelligence she showed and how she went against her personal belief to set Snape on fire.
Hated how she bossed them and how she sometimes acted superior. Especially what she says after the group runs to the dorm after facing the cerberus.
2nd Year
I loved how she stood by Harry and solved the basilisk problem.
I disliked how she jumped down Harry's throat about thievery. I also didn't like her arrogance with the potion. She could have unknowingly killed them all if that potion had only looked correct when it wasn't.
3rd
I love how she helped Hagrid and how she spoke to Trelawny. I loved how she didn't rat Remus out among other things. I love the punch and how she helped attack Snape.
I don't like the lack of tact she showed this year (Lavenders bunny, Ron's rat, and Harry's broom)
4th
I love how she stood by Harry and how she put Ron in his place when he insulted her ability to get a date.
I don't like how acted so offended about being in the of the boys' fight.( Does she not do the same to Harry during her and Ron's fights)
5th
I love how she tried to care for Harry's hand. I like the contract idea.
I do not like that she made a club and bullied Harry into leading it. (which made him the target in a fall out. I think Fudge would have sent Harry to azkaban if Dumbles hadn't stepped in) I don't like how she didn't try other means to send mail to Harry. I personally believe her love of authority is what caused it. I don't like how she was on Harry's case about the occlumency lessons when I believe Snape was the problem.
(sorry I just had problems with this book.)
6th
This book ruined everyone. Hermione acted like a jealous bitch to Harry.
7th
I love how prepared she was and her do what it takes attitude. I love how she stood by Harry.
I don't like how she was so quick to shoot Harry's ideas down. I also hate how she treated Harry about him not doing occlumency. She acted as if he got some perverse amusement watching in on Voldy. (could be wrong but that was the vibe I got)
I believe that without her faults the series probably would have been missing and important element. I do loke her I just have problems with her at times.
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Post by Kitty279 on Sept 23, 2012 4:55:23 GMT -5
*nods* You summed up very well what I think, too. I like her, but she could be pretty annoying, and that's why I have a problem with stories that glorify her and make her an infallible angel and the boys unable to do anything without her telling them what, when and how to do it. She certainly has her faults as well, and I appreciate it when she is called to task for them, not only Harry.
And while we are at it, it annoys the hell out of me when people in the RtB fics have her slap Harry every time she doesn't agree with something he does or says. She, of all people, should know that you don't keep hitting abused children!!
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Chameleon
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Post by Chameleon on Sept 23, 2012 4:55:44 GMT -5
Hermione is of course a vital person of the series. I think she developed in some ways from the eleven-year old girl to the seventeen year old. But you should usually have developed more, than she did. I don't really read fics, where Hermione is more hardened, and yeah. "It's the war." I know war changes people, but how come it first changed her after the war.
The books keep swing from an really confident Hermione to an insecure Hermione, with her tests. I know people get nervous, but Hermione goes straight in the top, when she apparently can manage do the Polyjuice potion without getting them killed. It's a bit confusing.
Does anyone finds it annoying that eleven-year old threatened to tattle on Ron and Harry? And then RtB's make excuses like, she just wants to be friends with them. I just wanted to yell, if you want to be friends, then you don't threat to tattle and act all that almighty. I know she got better to the point that she pushed Harry and Ron with herself, but that incident just ... annoys me greatly.
Hermione's need to act the superior, and make decisions for everyone. That she knows better than you, and therefor you have to comply. The basilisk thing would have been solved before, if Hermione had actually wanted to tell the others about her suspicion. And who goes running in a library, when there's a threat in the castle, and almost everyone are outside? She acted the same way about Rita, and D.A. I know she has difficulty with accepting that she's wrong some times, but just tell about suspicions, girl. They're not gonna laugh at you, if the suspicion is wrong.
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Post by Kitty279 on Sept 23, 2012 5:04:13 GMT -5
Yes, it annoyed me. That's not how you make friends, try to rat them out! How people see that as an excuse is beyond me. She complains about the boys having no clue how to treat someone when she is the worst of the lot.
True, if she had told Harry and Ron first, things might have turned out differently. But she can't say anything before she is thousand percent sure and can shine with her superior knowledge. Let Harry act the same way and she'd complain no end, of that I am sure. She has that need to know everything.
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Chameleon
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Post by Chameleon on Sept 23, 2012 7:23:55 GMT -5
Yeah. She might be a girl, and huffs when Ron has simply no tact. I think none of them have much tact, but the most tactful of them is Harry, apparently. She also simply overreacted when Ron said the thing about she was a nightmare. Alright, that wasn't nice said, but Ron didn't expect that she heard it. And it's perhaps hurting, and I know she's only eleven, but to skip classes to cry in a bathroom, because a boy said something hurting... *shakes head*.
Yeah. But well, that's her personality. Annoying.
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Post by Miss Wings on Sept 23, 2012 7:46:33 GMT -5
The thing that always bugged me was the 'obliviation' of her parents. If she truly believed in authority figures knowing best then surely she could have explained everything to her parents and let them decide what they wanted to do aswell as possibly providing them with portkeys that would be used with a word or sentance in order to get them to safety.
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Post by Kitty279 on Sept 23, 2012 7:59:27 GMT -5
Even easier, she just could have told them to move out of the country. If they were somewhere in Australia, then there's no need to wip their memories. Sure, her parents would worry more, but what is worse, worrying or losing all trust in your daughter when that comes out? And if they could be tracked down there and the DE's bothered to do it, then wiping their memories was completely useless, as it would NOT protect them anyway.
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Chameleon
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Post by Chameleon on Sept 23, 2012 7:59:38 GMT -5
Well, that has never really bugged me, but she should probably have given them a choice. But, well, she protected her parents. I think Hermione took some comfort into that if she died, they wouldn't remember her. It's of course sad, but I think it was her way protecting her parents.
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Post by Kitty279 on Sept 23, 2012 8:07:10 GMT -5
Yes, the intent was good, but the execution questionable. She's acting just like Dumbledore, deciding over the fate of others without asking for their opinion and not giving them a choice in the matter.
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Post by Miss Wings on Sept 23, 2012 8:17:45 GMT -5
When my parents saw that part they asked what was happening and so once the film ended I explained it to them and they were furious and that's just because of a book/film. To qoute my Mum "What the hell? If you ever did that to me I'd kill you, bury you and then repeat it a dozen times!"
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Post by Kitty279 on Sept 23, 2012 8:20:54 GMT -5
Can't say I blame your parents there, Wingy!
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Post by Miss Wings on Sept 23, 2012 8:22:12 GMT -5
I think that sealed the deal for them "DO NOT WATCH HARRY POTTER AGAIN!!!"
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Chameleon
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Post by Chameleon on Sept 23, 2012 8:27:36 GMT -5
Alright, it's questionable. Were Mr and Mrs. Granger the only family Hermione had? I could easily see the rest of family suddenly wonder where the hell they are, unless she of course altered everyone's memory.
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Post by Miss Wings on Sept 23, 2012 8:30:51 GMT -5
But what about their patients, friends and so forth?
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Post by Kitty279 on Sept 23, 2012 8:35:06 GMT -5
Good question. They had a practice, right? And if she changed their memories, would the even remember that? Could they sell them when they suddenly believe they have different names - when the deed is on the name Granger? Besides, their papers were on Granger - did Hermione forge new papers for them as well? They can't leave the country booking a flight under Wilkins when they are having passports with name Granger.
No, not very well thought out.
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Post by Miss Wings on Sept 23, 2012 8:39:20 GMT -5
This is going to sound wierd but what about children? What if they came back with other children? Children that they had whilst away, so many memories of a new life would be lost when Hermione gave them their old memories back..
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Post by Kitty279 on Sept 23, 2012 8:42:32 GMT -5
Hm ... would removing the memory block really make the newer memories vanish, or would they rather now have both sets? I'm more inclined to believe the latter. But yes, they could probably come back with new children, though Mrs. Granger would have been a bit old by then. That could actually drive a wedge between them and Hermione, when they have a happy new family and then this young woman comes and they find out what she did to them ...
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Chameleon
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Post by Chameleon on Sept 23, 2012 8:42:44 GMT -5
Yeah ... And she can't apparate all the way to Australia with two persons. Or can you do it? And then they need money - creditcard in the Wilkins name. A passport, you can't practically do anything without evidences. And of course the practice. I don't see a seventeen year old girl, no matter how smart she is, mange all that. Unless she got Dean Thomas' help to forge papers. Which I don't think she did.
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Post by Kitty279 on Sept 23, 2012 8:47:08 GMT -5
No, I don't think you can apparate that far in one go. Would probably have to do it in many smaller jumps. Which would prove its own problems. The book didn't sound like she did it, either, she just gave them the idea from what I remember.
Being good at drawing is very different from being able to forge official documents. There would be so many, passports, deeds to the house and practice and all ... and what do you do about the registers where it is listed who these places belong to? It just doesn't work.
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Post by Miss Wings on Sept 23, 2012 8:49:12 GMT -5
Hm ... would removing the memory block really make the newer memories vanish, or would they rather now have both sets? I'm more inclined to believe the latter. But yes, they could probably come back with new children, though Mrs. Granger would have been a bit old by then. That could actually drive a wedge between them and Hermione, when they have a happy new family and then this young woman comes and they find out what she did to them ... It is do-able to have children old, IVF etc.. If they had a longing for a child so much and in terms of the memories, they'd be conflicting with one another so much that they may not be able to cope and commit suicide maybe.. |
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Chameleon
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Post by Chameleon on Sept 23, 2012 9:13:42 GMT -5
Well they were only gone for a year ... But imagine if it had been longer, and Hermione shows up five years later, where they might have had a second child. Or Mrs. Granger could have been pregnant, when Hermione showed up. (I suddenly want to read something like that.)
So ... It would have been easier, if Hermione had allowed them to keep their memories, but had done something to protect them.
How are you sure, that Hermione didn't give her parents a choice? No memories of their former life, but they could walk around in a kind of freedom. Or just being locked inside somewhere with their memories.
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Post by Miss Wings on Sept 23, 2012 9:16:22 GMT -5
there is something like that.. i have it upstairs on my phone
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Post by dracosfairmaiden on Sept 23, 2012 9:36:59 GMT -5
Hermionie is one of my favorite characters but she does have some flaws. It's why I love this series so much: each character is so complex if you pay attention.
I did think she relied on authority a bit too much. She did try to rat out her friends a few times. I think she was just trying to protect her friends. What I love about her is that she didn't abandon Harry during the Horcrux hunt. She stuck by him even though she did nag him about Occulemency.
I never really thought about Hermione modifying her parent's memories. I do see the points you've made. What if they had created a new life in Australia? That would be awkward for everyone involved.
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Post by physicssquid on Sept 23, 2012 9:52:39 GMT -5
One problem I have with the bit about Hermione obliviating her parents, is that there is no detail.
There are also several questions I would loe to know the answers to:-
1)Did she tell them about the war or not?
2)Did she tell them she was going to remove their memories or just do it without their consent?
3)What if they actually told her to obliviate them?
The answers to those three questions could explain why Harry and Ron didn't shout at her when they found out. Because I'm sure that Harry would not have been happy to find out that Hermione had just obliviated her parents without their consent or knowledge, and if they told her to obliviate them, then I could understand Harry accepting it.
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Post by Nahara46 on Sept 23, 2012 11:41:24 GMT -5
Rita wouldn't have been able to badmouth him, as Hermione had blackmail against her. Yes, Hermione would have bit disgruntled that Harry didn't go along, but she'd get over it- it's a big thing that you can't force people to talk about.
Similarly, I object to Hermione being given all the blame.
Of course she'd be furious, anyone would be! However, once she cooled down a bit, she'd be a lot less... well, she wouldn't leave Harry in the dust like he and Ron did to her. I'm not denying that she wouldn't grumble about it, I know I would be very grumpy about it, but I'd deal.
But, wouldn't you think that his friend would mean more then a stupid broom? From the first book, it was clear Hermione didn't have many friends outside Harry and Ron- they both abandoned her, something I strongly disapprove of because loyalty is really important in my eyes.
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Post by Kitty279 on Sept 23, 2012 12:15:24 GMT -5
Rita wouldn't have been able to badmouth him, as Hermione had blackmail against her. Yes, Hermione would have bit disgruntled that Harry didn't go along, but she'd get over it- it's a big thing that you can't force people to talk about. She had already blackmailed her to do what she wanted for one year; Rita kept her part of the deal, so if Hermione kept doing it later on, she could have rightly pointed out that it wasn't fair. So, I don't think she would have hesitated to badmouth them after that year was over. Maybe, maybe not. She strikes me as someone who can't admit that others could be right and she wrong, save that other is authority, which Harry is not. But that's something that can be interpreted very differently. You should expect it, but don't forget that Harry felt betrayed because she tattled. Plus, there was already some bad blood about the Crookshanks/Scabbers problem. Plus, she was getting more and more short-tempered because she was overdoing the studying (giving her the time-turner to get to more classes was really idiotic). IMO there were a few things coming together to cause the problem, not just the broom. |
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Post by Nahara46 on Sept 23, 2012 17:00:51 GMT -5
Pointed out it wasn't fair? Of course it wasn't fair- it was blackmail! Hermione could have kept Rita quiet for as long as she wanted (Up until Voldie took over in the seventh book, when it wouldn't have mattered anyway.) because she could threaten to turn Rita in and get Rita in huge trouble.
But I'm not talking about admitting she was wrong. I myself have a really difficult time admitting when I am wrong (i used to be so bad, I would start crying whenever I didn't get my way), but I could forgive people and let it go. I wouldn't be able to say outright I'm sorry, but I'd try and be friendly.
I agree with you that emotions were running high by that point. Though, I don't think that her being given the time-turner was the bad idea, I think that McGonagall should have give Hermione a few tips on how not get completely over run, and to relax a bit, even if it meant even more time turning.
And yes, Harry did feel betrayed... But the fact that Hermione risked Harry's approval for his safety, makes her even more loyal. If I had to break off a friendship to keep my friend safe, I would do it in a heartbeat no matter how much it hurt me. Harry should have realized that Hermione was trying to help him, and keep him safe. I could deal with him being a bit icy and snappy toward her, but not him completely leaving her in the dust.
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Post by Miss Wings on Oct 6, 2012 9:38:35 GMT -5
and once again Star's managed to do the same to Hermione as she did the last chapter and considering this is the chapter where Lavender's pet rabbit dies then it helps us to understand why the adults aren't happy with Hermione..
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Post by Miss Wings on Nov 9, 2012 13:40:12 GMT -5
Star's getting a lot more Hermione bashing written into the fic now. it's not just about pets anymore.
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Post by Kitty279 on Nov 10, 2012 12:47:14 GMT -5
Yep, I noticed. And have to admit that I like it. Over time it becomes tiring when every author has every woman in the vicinity tear into Ron and Harry for every tiny little thing, while Hermione gets away with everything and is one of these always having a go at the boys and/or slapping them. So it's a refreshing change that finally someone is doing it differently.
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