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Post by Kitty279 on Jul 14, 2012 15:25:20 GMT -5
Exactly, you just put it better than I, but that's what I was thinking of.
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Post by ykickamoocow on Jul 14, 2012 15:45:09 GMT -5
A poorly run ministry maybe but all modern militaries and police forces have their leaders behind the front lines.
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sherza
Head Boy/Girl
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Post by sherza on Jul 14, 2012 16:01:39 GMT -5
A poorly run ministry maybe but all modern militaries and police forces have their leaders behind the front lines. Oh yes, and the Ministry For Magic, and Magical world in general, are *so* modern, aren't they? That was sarcasm, in case you missed it. Seriously, the Wizarding World is stuck in ... a previous era. Victorian at the best, straight-out mideival at worst. They would, therefore, be FAR more likely to have the 'generals' (whether head of DMLE or whatever title they go by) on the 'battlefield'. |
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Post by G. Novella on Jul 14, 2012 16:11:16 GMT -5
Forget that, poorly run seems efficient to describe the MoM.
Agh! Still typing! *slams ipod down*
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Post by physicssquid on Jul 14, 2012 16:27:23 GMT -5
Gnovella, what's your poor ipod ever done to you?
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Post by kumainpink on Jul 14, 2012 19:29:16 GMT -5
Wow, this discussion has gotten quite long...
*snerk*
As others have said before me, Harry wouldn't stay behind. It is not who he is or will ever be! Not after he's been conditioned by his experiences to be a self-sacrificing martyr! It's not healthy, but it's a trait that cannot be denied.
Coupled with the fact that Aurors a part of another department, and the fact that the Wizarding UK is way behind the times, and the only result is that Harry would go out on the big missions, at the very least.
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Post by ykickamoocow on Jul 14, 2012 23:20:52 GMT -5
A poorly run ministry maybe but all modern militaries and police forces have their leaders behind the front lines. Oh yes, and the Ministry For Magic, and Magical world in general, are *so* modern, aren't they? That was sarcasm, in case you missed it. Seriously, the Wizarding World is stuck in ... a previous era. Victorian at the best, straight-out mideival at worst. They would, therefore, be FAR more likely to have the 'generals' (whether head of DMLE or whatever title they go by) on the 'battlefield'. Except JKR herself said that Harry and Ron both moderised the Auror Office. |
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sherza
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Post by sherza on Jul 14, 2012 23:44:27 GMT -5
Oh yes, and the Ministry For Magic, and Magical world in general, are *so* modern, aren't they? That was sarcasm, in case you missed it. Seriously, the Wizarding World is stuck in ... a previous era. Victorian at the best, straight-out mideival at worst. They would, therefore, be FAR more likely to have the 'generals' (whether head of DMLE or whatever title they go by) on the 'battlefield'. Except JKR herself said that Harry and Ron both moderised the Auror Office. Yeah. They modernized it compared to what it had been. There is no way on god's green earth they managed to get Aurors from Victorian/Mideival era mentality and operation clear up to modern day mentality and operation in their lifetimes. They would have had to obtain magical equivalents to much of the gear that police require ... armor, instant communications regardless of location, and effective restraints not dependent on a spell that can be broken by one means or another. They'd also have to radically alter the thought-patterns and decision-making process not only of their own generation and all that followed, but of the elder generations still in control of the beauracracy that makes the laws the Aurors uphold and supplies the funds for their training and outfitting. Did they improve it? Of that, I have no doubt. But there's just no way to have made a two-hundred or more year jump in 19 years. Just ... no. |
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Post by ykickamoocow on Jul 14, 2012 23:57:55 GMT -5
You are basing all that speculation on little to no evidence. It is very reasonable to assume that being the head of the Aurors office is a desk job.
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Post by RogueNya on Jul 15, 2012 0:04:54 GMT -5
Hmmm I was surprised they never had him become one in the books given how often the subject came up in the books.
But anyways how about a Hare?
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sherza
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Post by sherza on Jul 15, 2012 0:08:05 GMT -5
Hmmm I was surprised they never had him become one in the books given how often the subject came up in the books. But anyways how about a Hare? Fast, which is good. Maneuverable, which is good. Scaredy-pants, everything-else-eats-me prey species. Not good. |
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Post by Kitty279 on Jul 15, 2012 0:34:28 GMT -5
You are basing all that speculation on little to no evidence. It is very reasonable to assume that being the head of the Aurors office is a desk job. See, and for that assumption you have as much proof as we have for ours. Where in the books is a list of what the Head Auror does? Again, you try to force 21th-century thinking on a 18th- or 19th-century society. Not going to work. And even if Harry revolutionised the Aurors, there's no way in hell that he's going to limit himself to a desk job. And Kingsley would allow him to do what he wants, no doubt. But it it were as you think, I'm pretty sure that Harry got fed up with that sort of work in no time and shortly after the epilogue quit. He'd be way too bored with paperwork and twiddling his thumbs while others do the work 8 hours a day. That's against all we have seen of Canon Harry who acted when the adults were useless. It's against his nature to leave everything to others. And Kingsley would be stupid to force him to only do the paper job. Who in his right mind would force the best man in action behind the desk? Harry's not the huge strategist, he's the one who can think quickly on his feet under pressure. He and his talents would be wasted with a desk-only job. |
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Post by RogueNya on Jul 15, 2012 2:23:26 GMT -5
Hmmm I was surprised they never had him become one in the books given how often the subject came up in the books. But anyways how about a Hare? Fast, which is good. Maneuverable, which is good. Scaredy-pants, everything-else-eats-me prey species. Not good. Well they are not exactly meant solely for offense, but maybe a magical Hare so can get bigger with a thought? But I can see where it bad for attacking another. Then beyond that I always pictured him having an exotic. Panther, Falcon, Phoenix. Those are my favorites. |
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sherza
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Post by sherza on Jul 15, 2012 2:44:34 GMT -5
Fast, which is good. Maneuverable, which is good. Scaredy-pants, everything-else-eats-me prey species. Not good. Well they are not exactly meant solely for offense, but maybe a magical Hare so can get bigger with a thought? But I can see where it bad for attacking another. Then beyond that I always pictured him having an exotic. Panther, Falcon, Phoenix. Those are my favorites. It's probably just a personal quirk, but I can't really see any of the main kids we know with with an animagus form that's so low on the prey totem pole. They're all too badass for that. My picks: Harry: Peregrine Falcon (for the previously stated reasons) Hermione: Red-Tailed Fox (intelligence and ability to come up with solutions to problems) Neville: Brown Bear (placid and inoffensive most of the time, but god help your ass if you piss one off. *snerk*) Fred: Black-Footed Ferret (for the mischief) George: Raccoon (Ditto) Ron: Honey Badger Ginny: Bengal Tigress I never sat down and figured one out for Luna, mostly because I don't write her. I like her, but I can't even *begin* to write her rather ... unique ... character. The others I had to sit down and figure out because the animagus thing comes up in my fics (Harry initially, but like HELL the twins aren't going to emulate their heroes, and the others get dragged into it one way or another) |
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Post by Kitty279 on Jul 15, 2012 3:02:29 GMT -5
Personally, I like the idea of a Peregrine Falcon, as it really does seem to fit with Harry's personality and interests. Besides, it reminds me of a certain irrepressible Peregrin Took, and with it to my other fandom.
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Post by RogueNya on Jul 15, 2012 4:43:46 GMT -5
Those are great ideas and read a story with those not long ago actually.
I could see Luna being a Hare lol, but I dunno she gives a more Pegasus or Unicorn feel.
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sherza
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Post by sherza on Jul 15, 2012 4:49:50 GMT -5
Those are great ideas and read a story with those not long ago actually. I could see Luna being a Hare lol, but I dunno she gives a more Pegasus or Unicorn feel. If you read a story with those exact animagus choices, chances are VERY good it was one of mine. Especially if the 'Marauder Names' were Rascal, Rogue, Baloo, Grumbler (among others) |
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Post by RogueNya on Jul 16, 2012 2:16:43 GMT -5
Those are great ideas and read a story with those not long ago actually. I could see Luna being a Hare lol, but I dunno she gives a more Pegasus or Unicorn feel. If you read a story with those exact animagus choices, chances are VERY good it was one of mine. Especially if the 'Marauder Names' were Rascal, Rogue, Baloo, Grumbler (among others) I believe they were, I would have to look for it assuming it is even still on ff.net, plus do not remember the name lol, but it was a great story though. |
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sherza
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Post by sherza on Jul 16, 2012 2:25:50 GMT -5
If you read a story with those exact animagus choices, chances are VERY good it was one of mine. Especially if the 'Marauder Names' were Rascal, Rogue, Baloo, Grumbler (among others) I believe they were, I would have to look for it assuming it is even still on ff.net, plus do not remember the name lol, but it was a great story though. If it's mine, it's definitely still on ff.net, under Sherza, and the name'd be Harry Potter and the Fate We Make ... that's the one where all of them get named *nodnod* |
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Post by RogueNya on Jul 16, 2012 3:43:00 GMT -5
I believe they were, I would have to look for it assuming it is even still on ff.net, plus do not remember the name lol, but it was a great story though. If it's mine, it's definitely still on ff.net, under Sherza, and the name'd be Harry Potter and the Fate We Make ... that's the one where all of them get named *nodnod* Then I think I did read it then ^^ |
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sherza
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Post by sherza on Jul 16, 2012 3:47:32 GMT -5
If it's mine, it's definitely still on ff.net, under Sherza, and the name'd be Harry Potter and the Fate We Make ... that's the one where all of them get named *nodnod* Then I think I did read it then ^^ It's hard to keep track sometimes, innit? I've read so many stories the details all blur together and I can't remember which story had what going on, or what site it was on, because I read fic from places other than ff.net just to make life REALLY interesting. |
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Post by Kitty279 on Jul 16, 2012 7:15:09 GMT -5
Oh, I know the feeling. There were so many times when I could remember details from some story, but for the life of me not the title or author. Really annoying. Well, I guess that's what you get for reading too many fics ...
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Post by RogueNya on Jul 16, 2012 21:37:27 GMT -5
*nods* I have a X-men one that is a Romy that I have been searching for, for ages now but have yet to find it again since I read it. Which was either before I joined or was reading during one the times the login area was not working so could not Alert it. So I am constantly on a lookout for it.
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Post by nightphoenix7101 on Jul 21, 2012 13:53:26 GMT -5
I would go with the Raven idea, as Harry loves flying, it would have some of his features: black feather, green eyes. And they are really cool
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Post by blackroses77 on Jul 21, 2012 14:24:53 GMT -5
*sigh* I don't talk about every tiny little investigation, I talk about the big actions like taking out a group of criminals holed up in a house. Why would Harry get involved in that though. That is not his job. Simple put Harry is in charge he can do what he wants meaning if he felt the urge to get out in the field every once in a while he could. I can't see him sitting idle behind his desk all the time. And I have watched several tv shows (two that come to mind are Sentinel and Grimm) where the Captain went out on a couple of field assignments. Yes the shows are fiction but so is Harry Potter. |
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Post by teflonbilly on Jul 26, 2012 19:36:25 GMT -5
Uh, guys, as someone who is in the US Army I can tell you that Generals do not "sit back and send others to risk their necks"
Just because they HAVE to command from a place that seems far from the front-lines as you see it, that does not actually mean that aren't actively leading the troops subordinate to them.
Generals during the Civil War lead from the battlefields, sometimes right in the thick of it, because that is the nature of war back then and due to the lack of long distance communications, long range artillery, and a whole host of other things. If they had had the capability of leading from a HQ a few miles from the battlefield as effectively as we can now (or even as effectively as during WWII) they wouldn't have been on the battlefields directly, because directly directing the course of a battle like that is NOT the role of a general. In modern militaries, you push as much command authority and operational initiative to the lowest level as you are able.
Now, to the topic of Aurors, Harry Potter, and Magical Law Enforcement in general, I think we are all stuck in a bind because JKR lost a bit of focus during the course of the books, and never really nailed down roles and such with regards to what exactly Aurors did.
I prefer to stick with the original description of what they do (Dark Wizard Catchers) rather than what they became (Magical Policemen)
Because at the begginning of the books (at least as far as PoA) there were several distinct jobs implied that made the distinctions much more clear, you had Magical Law Enforcement Agents (Encompassing Patrolmen and Detective roles), Hit-Wizards (they come off as SWAT Teams), and then Aurors.
But by the end of the books the term Auror pretty much encompassed any and all police, military, and civil authority agents in to one, which is not how they were originally described.
How do I see Aurors? I see them, obviously, as the best of the best at tracking down and capturing Dark Wizards (which is a totally ambiguous term of course) What is a Dark Witch or Wizard, I look to folklore to help myself envision who these types are. I'm not talking about the guys that Arthur deals with, those the enchant things to harass and hurt muggles. I'm thinking that Aurors are the ones that go take down the Witch in Hansel & Gretel, a witch roasting muggle children in her oven to devour their bodies, subsume their souls to extend her life, etc....
A good description for Aurors, now that I think about it, would be very close to a CIA Paramilitary Operations Officer, agents that must work alone or in very small teams, going into very dangerous situations and through skill, training, and intelligence are able to achieve their mission with very little outside help.
Now, I see the head of the Auror office to be more akin to a US Special Forces Battalion Commander. Owing to how elite Aurors are, I don't see the Auror department being much bigger than a US SF Battalion anyways. A commander at that level is just at the cusp of moving between a purely tactical role (actively hunting down Dark Wizards) and a more operational role (leading from the front lines but from the headquarters office.) Also, keep in mind, Harry & Ron were CO-heads of this office, it wasn't just Harry that reformed the Aurors)
Julius Root from Artemis Fowle would be a good example, mostly desk job but strapping a gun to his hip and getting into the thick of things when he needs to.
And another thing that leads me to feel that Harry would/could not be the usual desk jocky commander is that Wizards/Witches by their very nature accrue/acrete skill and actual raw power as they get older. Normal muggles as they get older just gain knowledge and experience, after a certain point age makes them incapable of doing what they used to relatively quickly (45-50 years old) whereas Wizards and Witches only become more capable as they get older.
JKR was very inconsistant in making this clear (especially with how many characters had parents die at what comes off as a very very young age, even for muggles. Like Sirius, James, and Lily's parents, and by implication Arthur and Molly's parents, you never hear about Weasley/Prewett grandparents.) But it's all there that Wizards live longer than muggles, they stay spryer and more active longer (100+ years old) and again, they only get more magically capable (non-verbal spells, wandless magic, etc...)
TB
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Post by teflonbilly on Jul 26, 2012 19:52:53 GMT -5
Now on the thread topic:
I agree with those that say Harry would be a flyer, and because of that I'm in a bit of a toss-up between a Falcon (for speed, grace, natural offensive ability) and a common raven (for Harry's black hair, it being a relatively large bird, and strength.)
Now the other characters, I like the idea of Ron being a lion (his tendency to roar and yell, natural inclination toward laziness but being athletic is very feline, and because lions let the lionesses do most of the work but ferocious when dealing with threats to the pack)
Hermione, an Owl is my first pick due to it's cultural association with knowledge and learning but because she just doesn't come off as a flyer, I'd lean more towards a wolverine (her temperment) or some other predator. I just don't see Hermione as a herbivore.
Ginny, I like the idea of her being a Harpy Eagle or some other large bird of prey because she is the youngest and most often described as the smallest. But a housecat or bobcat also seem very likely.
Neville as a black bear just seems too perfect.
TB
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sherza
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Post by sherza on Jul 26, 2012 20:09:54 GMT -5
I decided on a fox for Hermione, to address the flying issue ... they have an equal reputation for intelligence, and better yet, of the tricksy kind, not just pure knowledge. Hermione IS a storehouse of knowledge, but she's also willing to use said knowledge in ... ummm ... highly unconventional ways (illegal brewing of Polyjuice, anyone? To name just *one* incident among MANY).
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Post by teflonbilly on Jul 26, 2012 20:12:42 GMT -5
I decided on a fox for Hermione, to address the flying issue ... they have an equal reputation for intelligence, and better yet, of the tricksy kind, not just pure knowledge. Hermione IS a storehouse of knowledge, but she's also willing to use said knowledge in ... ummm ... highly unconventional ways (illegal brewing of Polyjuice, anyone? To name just *one* incident among MANY). FOX! That's it, perfect. Thank you Sherza. Yup, especially when you consider a female fox is a vixen, and EW is quite the vixen (in beauty.) TB |
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sherza
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Post by sherza on Jul 26, 2012 21:47:23 GMT -5
You're welcome. As I said earlier in this thread, I actually had to sit down and think about what critters the gang (sans Luna, who I just can't write. Adore her, but cannot write her) would turn into for my fics. The only one I wasn't really absolutely thrilled about the choice for was Ginny (a tigress) but I couldn't really think of anything eminently suitable ... and needed a second larger animal (as Neville had the only animal that weighed more than about sixty pounds) that could really bring the pain in a close-quarters brawl if one came up.
Not that honey badgers are anything to laugh at ...
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